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OCEANSIDE: Dog beach idea faces opposition from city, neighbors
Proponents vow to push for amenity anyway
By PAUL SISSON - Staff Writer | ∞
Dogs meet and play at Dog Beach recently in Del Mar. Some residents in Oceanside are lobbying to create a dog beach there, but city officials have panned the idea for now. (Photo by Hayne Palmour IV - Staff Photographer) OCEANSIDE ---- Though some residents are pushing for a dog beach in Oceanside, city leaders said last week that allowing pooches at the mouth of the San Luis Rey River was a bad idea for now.
That's because there are already problems with pollution at the river mouth and adding dog droppings to the mix would only muddle the situation, officials said.
City Manager Peter Weiss said Oceanside is about to start a two-year study of the river to determine why it is perennially polluted and that dogs could skew the results of the work.
"Adding another potential pollutant source is a concern when we're trying to determine why the river is polluted," Weiss said.
City officials spelled out their concerns about the dog beach idea in a letter last month to the City Council and to Oceanside resident Hugh Foley, who is leading a campaign to allow pets on that slice of shoreline.
Foley said last week that interest in the dog beach is growing, despite the city's opposition. About 30 Oceanside residents have joined "Friends of an Oceanside Dog Beach," a grass-roots organization Foley created to advocate for a dog beach at the river mouth.
He said he understands the city's position, but is not discouraged by its outright dismissal the idea.
"I think that's the natural response to anything new that comes along," Foley said. "The first thing they always want to do is say no."
Foley said he and his fellow dog-beach advocates have read several studies that find dog-beach users actually can have a positive effect on beach cleanliness.
He said some studies show that dog owners taking their pets to a dog beach "pick up after themselves really well."
Foley said if Oceanside creates a dog beach, he would support some volunteer enforcement to make sure folks keep it clean.
Weiss said he understands that dog beach proponents intend to clean up after their pets. But the city manager noted that in other parts of the city, dog walkers are often lax in their cleanup duties.
"There is certainly evidence all over this community that there are pet owners that are not responsible," Weiss said.
Mo Lahsaie, coordinator of the city's clean water program, said Oceanside already has received a $554,375 grant to perform DNA testing of river water to determine where elevated levels of fecal coliform bacteria are coming from.
He said a dog beach near the river would confound testing.
"It's nothing against the dogs, but the timing is just not good right now," Lahsaie said.
In addition to opposition from the professionals at City Hall, dog lovers face certain and ferocious opposition from the North Coast Village condominium complex just south of the river mouth.
In 1998, when the Oceanside City Council considered a dog beach on the same site, it was North Coast Village property owners who spoke out loudest against the proposal, eventually leading to a 4-1 council vote against the idea.
William Cousins, the government affairs representative for the condo complex's homeowners association, said in a recent e-mail that any attempt to create a dog beach at the river mouth will spark an immediate response.
"The problems of dog mess, health hazards, nuisance and noise, environmental issues, cost and management, plus additional parking problems outweigh any arguments for this idea," Cousins wrote.
Foley said he is not deterred by the condo board's position. He noted that the idea of a dog beach in Oceanside appeals to residents who live far east of Interstate 5.
Shelley Graves, a member of Foley's group who lives near College and Oceanside boulevards, said she used to drive to Del Mar once a week to let her dog, Winnie, run on the beach.
"Since gas has gone up so much, we can't really do that anymore," Graves said. "It would just be so nice to just take her here in Oceanside. I wouldn't mind paying an entry fee if that's what it takes to make sure that it stays perfectly clean."
North County's only other dog beach is in Del Mar, just north of the San Dieguito River mouth.
Despite the city's assertion that a dog beach at the San Luis Rey would hurt water quality, that has not necessarily been the case for the San Dieguito.
According to the most recent bacteria report, published by the California Regional Water Quality Control Board in December, 2007, the San Dieguito and San Luis Rey river mouths were classified as "bacteria impaired."
The report states that while both rivers exceeded maximum allowable levels of fecal coliform bacteria, the San Dieguito River carried less bacteria than the San Luis Rey.
In dry weather, according to the report, the San Luis Rey exceeds bacteria limits by about 60 percent while the San Dieguito exceeds its limits by about 26 percent.
Weiss said that the difference in bacteria levels is interesting, but ultimately irrelevant.
"We have a bacteria problem there now that we have an obligation to take care of," Weiss said.
Contact staff writer Paul Sisson at (760) 901-4087 or psisson@nctimes.com.
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bat wrote on Jul 13, 2008 7:27 PM:I can't believe they got a grant for over $500,000.00 to find out what is causing the polution in the river, Duh, it's the people living in the river bed. Any moron could tell you that. What a waste of taxpayer dollars. As for the dog beach, the dogs are cleaner than the people.
local osider wrote on Jul 13, 2008 7:31 PM:How do we join the friends of dog beach organization? that would be nice to know????
Good grief wrote on Jul 13, 2008 8:45 PM:We have over 175,000 people, and we're challenged on beaches for people already. I suggest you help out with the next beach cleanup! This is definitely NOT a good idea. There are more people AGAINST than FOR, and that's only logical. I would support another dog park, but NOT a dog beach.
Why not try Carlsbad?
Hmmm... wrote on Jul 13, 2008 9:55 PM:Too funny. Dog beach in Del Mar is right in front of one house worth $50 Million and people in O'Side think they're better than those people?
Especially in front of the ugliest part of the beach by the Harbor?
Not to mention there are NO beach houses in the area PLENTY of WIDE open space...and they think a little dog poop is gonna make it worse?
Give me a break!!!
By the way... wrote on Jul 13, 2008 9:58 PM:WHY NOT CARLSBAD?
BECAUSE IT'S A STATE BEACH NOT UNDER THE CITIES POWER TO DO WELL...ANYTHING!
Umm.. wrote on Jul 13, 2008 10:31 PM:The dog owners can't even pick up the dog logs on the north side of Grandview st. We don't need a pooch poop beach.
OCEANSIDE GUY wrote on Jul 13, 2008 10:35 PM:Lots of drums are thumped for dogs by guess who? Pet food companies, pet stores, dog grooming joints, veternarians, dog breeders and anybody who makes bucks from dogs. In a lot of European cities (Rejknavik, Iceland is one) no dogs are allowed in the city limits for safety and sanitary reasons. When dogs dump in the sand it's not cleaned up simply by the owner grabbing it with a plastic bag, some of the feces remain in the sand. I love dogs, but keep them off our public beaches and out of our parks too. They ruin parks by pooping on the grass and chasing any wildlife away. And in Oceanside the City Code requires that a dog be kept on a leash no longer than 6 feet when out of its yard. Dog owners are notorious for not doing that and for letting their hound poop on other peoples' property and urinate on their plants. NO DOG BEACH. I don't live near the beach, so that's not why I oppose a dog beach.
Alex wrote on Jul 13, 2008 11:59 PM:You wouldn't like my kids running around relieving themselves on your beach or in front of your house, so why should the rest of us cut you some slack with your dogs on this issue?
Beach to the dogs wrote on Jul 14, 2008 12:45 AM:North Coast Village owners think that the beach belongs to them.
Les wrote on Jul 14, 2008 4:23 AM:A half million dollars to find out where the fecal coli form bacteria are coming from. Are you kidding? Hey Peter, does a bear pooh in the woods? No, Oceanside doesn’t have bears. Do the homeless pooh in the riverbed? Yes! Now, do I get the half mill?
go dog beach wrote on Jul 14, 2008 4:28 AM:I wish we had a dog beach- I'd pay and entrance fee. I live off college/76 and would love to have a quick drive. I think the city needs to reevaluate it's position- who cares if the condo's don't want it- not their choice. Why should we wait while you do some over funded study- turns out if you got rid of all the lowlifes in the river bed (who start fires) you might get rid of the fecal coliform... duh!
Pooch lover wrote on Jul 14, 2008 6:07 AM:Dog beach at the harbor-stupid idea. Can you imagine the marketing of the new developments over there? Come one, come all bring your dogs to our dog beach? NO THANK YOU. We have a DOG PARK. The San Dieguito River is WAY different from the SLR - they don't have 1/10th the development Oceanside has along the river. A comparison between apples and oranges.
My my geoffrey wrote on Jul 14, 2008 6:56 AM:If humans urinated and defecated right there, on the beach, with the abandon that dogs do-do, there wouldn't be a "human beach" either. Would you have your children swim down-current from a dog beach? I don't believe you would. Pollution from feces, dog or otherwise, is a real concern, or haven't you ever heard od the Tijuana River with its sewage causing beaches in San Diego to be closed due to the Tijuana River.
Vista Granny wrote on Jul 14, 2008 7:01 AM:Dog owners who drive to the beach so their dogs can run in the sand and waves probably clean up after their pets. I know the dog park by the Humane Society is kept quite clean. If not a dog beach, then what about a dog lake some place? Real dogs love water.
DawdDungIt wrote on Jul 14, 2008 7:41 AM:If you want an example of what the beach would look like, go to Buccaneer Park some evening and watch people letting their dogs run. We don't go there anymore because of the splendor (left behind) in the grass. It's actually kind of disgusting, it doesn't smell to good, but if your into that kind of thing it's the place for you. Come to think of it , the world is going to crap anyway, so what's a little poo on the shoo?
purebred wrote on Jul 14, 2008 8:28 AM:Just put up signs and the pooch bags to clean up after your pet like they do in Del Mar and there wouldn't be anyone who would not clean up after there pooch without getting scolded by the other pooch owners. Dog Beach in Oceanside is a great idea.
LOL wrote on Jul 14, 2008 8:31 AM:To bat...
The dogs are cleaner than the people? If dogs were able to clean up after themselves, then I'd say that is true.
But LOL wrote on Jul 14, 2008 8:48 AM:The truth is that dogs have fewer types of germs than humans and by that definition, they are "cleaner". That said, dog feces still pose a health hazard to humans and that is an incontrovertible fact.
Yokozuna wrote on Jul 14, 2008 8:54 AM:What ever we do let's not ask the Del Mar people how their is working out. Or what they feel they did right or wrong. Let's just use speculation on what will or will not happen.
Sorry Vista Granny wrote on Jul 14, 2008 8:57 AM:but there are too many people who can't or won't be bothered with picking up after their dogs and to whom signs and laws mean nothing. I agree that dogs need room to romp, that is why getting a dog should not be done without consideration of the needs of the dog and without a place that the person owns for the dog to relieve itself. People who do not pick up their dog's feces have a special place in Hell reserved just for them and I think that it is over head-high in doggy doo-doo.
He Said wrote on Jul 14, 2008 8:58 AM:I wonder if the surfers are concerned if some study will conclude their urine and fecal matter does not enhance the ocean. Ever see one of them come out of the ocean to use a rest room?
NCV Owner wrote on Jul 14, 2008 9:18 AM:1. Will the dogs run and romp? No because they need to be leashed!
2. Where will the owners park? Have you been there lately?
3. Why would anyone say who cares what we think? You do realize it is our backyard even if we don't own it? There are 550 condos- how about we open a dog park in your closest public place or your back yard?
We know it's not our beach. In fact it isn't a beach at all its a river bed. It doesn't matter what is going on at Del Mar - the mouth of a river is a bad place to allow a dog park as there will be increased bacteria. There is no such thing as 100% compliance.
Important Issues wrote on Jul 14, 2008 9:40 AM:Finally we have something improtant to take up as a CIty Council, now that we have that inportant invasive weed policy in place we can tackle Dog poop on the beaches. This is only preliminary work to get us ready for taking on the issue of Gang Violence in the community, after that World Peace.
Good News Dog Lovers wrote on Jul 14, 2008 12:29 PM:The Chinese government has ordered dog off all restaurant menus during the Olympics. So I while you can’t walk the dog on a beach in Oceanside, nobody can wok the dog in China. Sounds fair. Les.
PJ wrote on Jul 14, 2008 1:23 PM:Dog owners are like cigarette smokers, leaving their messy excrement for others to pick up for them... While many owners carry bags to clean-up after their animals, many do not, letting their animals deficate and urninate in whatever yard suits them, without consideration of residents. Can you imagine the fecal/urinary mess on our beaches if this inconsiderate lot were left to run free? Ugh! Oceanside needs to clean-up its image not sully it further.
The Truth wrote on Jul 14, 2008 1:31 PM:The Truth of the matter is City Planners would hate to see an Open view of the coastal area planned for a dog beach.
Because, it would impede on thier plans to build as close as possible to the coast and ruin coastal life for all, Human and Dogs.
Tisk, Tisk only oceanside would say no to a dog park
ITs Funny wrote on Jul 14, 2008 1:35 PM:Its funny how people are saying well the majority is in opposition, ...
Ya So?
Many other important issues have arised and More than Majority was in opposition,,,,,,,and uhhhh....
The City Planning & Council still approved them....
So keep up the fight for a dog beach! My dogs would love to see the beach.
Don't forget whenever we have been to Del Mars.....I have never seen a dogs dumpings, and its because,
Dogs won't #1 or 2 playing in water....they usually take care of business on the way to the car or on the way home...so no worries on polluting the beaches peoples....
Exactly City Dog BagCan wrote on Jul 14, 2008 1:42 PM:Duh, that is my whole reason to think, if the people who bring up issues of people not picking after dogs.....
I am sure I own dogs and if you run out the door, sometimes its an honest mistake you forget the bag...and your like well I wish this city provided those dog/bag/can...like other ciities do!!!!!!!!
People would be more into picking up dog tootsie-rolls and putting into a marked can. If anything it would generate more Oceanside jobs???
So what is wrong with our City for not providing these needed equipment.
We should not argue with one another or try to control how each of us acts, yet we need to ask the City to step up and take care of public means...for ALL...!!
Can't wait to get some young blood in council and city dept. Not the liven in the 50's....change is good, we are supose to be better than the last generation....and hence why Oside is behind.
esteban wrote on Jul 14, 2008 2:16 PM:Oceanside has a big enough beach area to accomodate man and beast. I say let the dogs have their beach. As for bacteria there is enough bacteria from raw sewage spills to fill anyones taste. Let the dogs have their beach! I support their cause.
Dog Lover wrote on Jul 14, 2008 4:35 PM:It is time for the city council to remember we need to have "quality of life" here in Oceanside. That means places for us to enjoy our city. I have been here my entire life - they keep building places for people to live - but keep forgetting about places to enjoy ourselves. The people that will use dog beach will clean up after their dogs because they are considerate people that love their pets. People that let their dogs run free are the problem - the humane society needs to do their job and pick up the strays. Do not penalize the good owners - Let us have a dog beach!
Good News wrote on Jul 14, 2008 4:54 PM:The beach is for private of North Coast Village residents anyways....
Sewer wrote on Jul 14, 2008 5:09 PM:I suggest a fast-forward to the time the dog beach has been there for 2 years. I predict a fetid and festering sewer of a beach with permanent health hazard warning signs everywhere down wind and wherever the tide takes the pollution. A wonderful improvement to the quality of life. Not!
PJ wrote on Jul 14, 2008 9:09 PM:Dog owners who let their dogs piss and crap on property belonging to others should have the courage of publicizing their names and addresses so that residents can return the favor by dumping excrement and urine on the offending dog-owners' front porch steps.
oside mom wrote on Jul 15, 2008 12:34 AM:To PJ: Thank you very much! I can't tell you how many times I have had to clean up after the "considerate" dog owners in my neighborhood. I would love to be able to "return" the favor!
jr wrote on Jul 15, 2008 5:29 AM:liability...dog owners seem to think they can read the dogs minds...can do no harm. i was out for a week after a dog tripped me up while jogging on oceanside beach...dog owner fled the scene before i could get up. no dogs on oceanside people beaches please...doo doo in someone elses back yard...go to del mar
Vista Granny wrote on Jul 15, 2008 7:38 AM:I wonder if all those commenting about how filthy a dog beach would be really believe that dog owners like to walk in poop. It's your neighbor who likes to sneak his dog out after dark who leaves the mess, not the dog beach user.
CommonSense wrote on Jul 15, 2008 11:38 AM:Those opposed would like us to ignore that there are existing dog beaches WITHOUT the problems they use as scare tactics.
Since dog owners rarely spend more then an hour or so on the beach each trip, some ticketed parking like they have in DelMar should provide both spots and revenue.
To Exactly City Dog wrote on Jul 15, 2008 11:49 AM:That's why you should have what I do ... a bag dispenser that remains attached to my dogs leash. There is no forgetting.
That aside ... they do have dog doo bags at the harbor.
To PJ wrote on Jul 15, 2008 11:52 AM:I have a neighbor whose dog always seems to "get out" somehow and poohs on my lawn. You should have seen the look on the owners face when I knocked on their door and made them walk down to my house to clean up the mess.
They don't speak to me anymore, but it was worth it because their dog doesn't 'get out' anymore either.
crap wrote on Jul 15, 2008 4:01 PM:The last thing we need is more crap in Oceanside. We have enough run down ugly building and trash aound this town. Why is it that a few people always seem to get there way. Just like the few who showed up at the coastal commission hearing to ruin our town and prevent the manchester project. We have enough crap in this town we don't need more from a bunch of dog owners who Will not pick up after their dogs. I see it every day on the beach strand and I actually like dogs.
Heavy fine wrote on Jul 15, 2008 4:13 PM:I might say yes if owners were given a $5,000. fine for not picking up their dogs crap. No warnings it is the few that ruin it for everyone else. The smokers don't care there is a no smoking ban on the beach I see it everyday and _________ no one______does enything about it. It is a useless law if not enforced. If we were tougher things would be better for everyone.
Big Dog Owner wrote on Jul 15, 2008 9:23 PM:I have a large dog that needs to be run daily. He would LOVE to swim. However, I'm against a dog beach in Oside because dog beaches are just nasty. The moisture lets worms survive longer so the next dog (or child) can get them. I don't think that because I have a dog that likes to have fun, that the beach should become a giant litter box for him and his friends. People Before Pets! I love my dog, but I value health & safety for humans more.
Osider wrote on Jul 16, 2008 10:39 AM:That section of the beach will actually be cleaner because of the dogs. Why? because the type of people that would take their dogs there will pick up ALL the trash. Cigarette butts are more harmful to the ocean than dog feces. I say lets make Oside a better place by putting in a dog beach, Del Mar is a better place for their dog beach. Incidetally the only reason the prima donnas in Del Mar have a dog beach is because they had to allow dogs when they decided to allow horses (from the race track) on the beach
Diane wrote on Jul 18, 2008 10:13 AM:I am absolutely in favor of a dog beach. Other communities have been able to do a great job with this. Dog owners who use the beach are responsible in my experience, and I believe would want to take care of the site. It's called pride!
To the people who say "the majority doesn't want this dog beach in Oceanside" I say, how are you qualified to make this statement? Until now I have not voiced my opinion, and I am completely in favor of it. I'm sure there are many others out there who haven't had the avenue to express their support yet, especially since this issue is just now being exposed in the media.
Also, well said by "The Truth"! It seems the City Council is much more interested in economic growth and grabbing up open space than they are in community and what many of us came to Oceanside for in the first place!
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