REGION: I-15 work triggers search for new rail route
Officials say county has good shot at money from November bond measure
By DAVE DOWNEY - Staff Writer | ∞
SAN DIEGO ---- Two months before Californians vote on a $9.95 billion bond measure for trains, state rail officials are going back to the drawing board to map out a new route for 20 miles of high-speed railroad tracks in North County.
Peter Gertler, project manager for the system's Los Angeles-to-San Diego corridor, said Wednesday that construction of express lanes on Interstate 15 between Escondido and Miramar will preclude laying down tracks next to the freeway.
"There's just no more room through there," Gertler said.
He made the comments following a news conference in downtown San Diego held to drum up support for the November ballot measure and calm fears that high-speed rail bond money might not be spent locally.
Gertler is vice president and national rail director at HNTB Corp. in Oakland. HNTB is the lead consultant on the southern piece of the 800-mile statewide project and Gertler is coordinating preliminary engineering and environmental studies.
Gertler said the original idea was to build the railroad along the west side of I-15. Now planners are looking for other routes because that idea no longer will work, he said.
There is a slight chance planners could keep the train in the I-15 corridor by elevating the tracks above freeway lanes, he said. But that may not be feasible.
"There's bridges in there that weren't there before," Gertler said.
Farther north, between Escondido and Temecula, there is still room to squeeze the tracks into the I-15 corridor, as planned, Gertler said.
The section between San Diego and Los Angeles, running through inland San Diego County and western Riverside County, is expected to cost $8 billion, state officials said.
That compares with $30 billion for the section between Anaheim and San Francisco and $45 billion for the whole system.
Proposition 1A, the $9.95 billion bond measure on the November ballot for trains, contains $9 billion for high-speed rail and $950 million for improvements to existing passenger railroads, such as the one on the North County coast.
When crafted several years ago, the measure reserved all $9 billion in high-speed rail funds for the Anaheim-to-San Francisco leg, which state officials are calling phase one.
Los Angeles to San Diego is phase two.
With the signing of legislation last week, all regions of the state ---- including San Diego and Riverside counties ---- would get a crack at the $9 billion. However, a prominent regional transportation official said last month that the bill, because it was watered down, might result in only a few dollars trickling south of Los Angeles.
The bill says bond money can be spent in any corner of the state ---- just as long as it does not get in the way of building tracks between Anaheim and San Francisco.
At a news conference held before a California High-Speed Rail Authority board meeting in San Diego, board members sought to assuage fears that San Diego County won't get bond money.
Quentin Kopp, board chairman and a retired judge, said, "San Diego is very much a significant, strong part of this project. And don't be disillusioned or discouraged otherwise."
Even if little bond money were to flow south, Kopp said, that would not jeopardize the southern section because billions in federal and private money will be spent on the project, too, Kopp said.
Mehdi Morshed, authority executive director, said it will take eight years to complete the first phase and another five years to extend the line to San Diego.
Lynn Schenk of San Diego, board member and longtime high-speed rail advocate, touted the project's benefits.
"Think of the comfort and convenience of zipping to L.A. in little more than an hour," Schenk said.
Gary Gallegos, executive director of the San Diego Association of Governments, said his agency has pledged to work with the authority and other regional agencies to plan the Southern California section.
Contact staff writer Dave Downey at (760) 745-6611, Ext. 2623, or ddowney@nctimes.com.
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Frank wrote on Sep 3, 2008 7:19 PM:Of course the tracks would be built from Anaheim to S.F. first. I would have no problem supporting such a measure, if the S.D. riverside corridor was guaranteed upon completion of the LA-SF link.
Oceanside Chris wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:13 PM:Finally, a real use of the Sprinter tracks.
Mac wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:23 PM:The train should go down the center of I-15. Buses are not the answer.
Ron wrote on Sep 3, 2008 10:35 PM:About 5 years ago when John Barna, now the CEO of Ca. Transportation Commission, worked for Ca. Highspeed Rail, he told me that most of the high speed rail system between Temecula and Escondido would have to be underground (tunnels) because of the excessive grades from Temecula through the mountains to Escondido. Tunnel excavation is very expense, especially 30 miles of it. Ask questions of these people pushing this 9.9 billion dollar bond. Will we really ever get highspeed rail or will we just be paying for the LA to SFO portion?
tear up the wrote on Sep 3, 2008 10:40 PM:Now that we've spent billions on the pay per use 15 zipper lanes. Let's tear them up for a train. Why not... It's the way transportation works. Build a bridge, tear it down to expand the freeway, and build the bridge again, repeat... We have to keep those consultants and engineers employed. Screw the commuters who have to navigate these endless construction zones.
Umm.. wrote on Sep 3, 2008 11:15 PM:Busses blow. Hard. Put rail on the freeway centers and make it run with both express and local trains. An hour to go from Oceanside to Escondido is just nuts. That thing takes far too long. ..and then to have to ride Tour de North County bus routes before and after using the Sprinter turns your commute into a 2 hour adventure, times two and thats four hours a day. A car.. 40 minutes. Where's the savings? I know it can't be as fast as, but how about half? Put the high speed rail on the coast where there is already right-of-way established.
John Q. wrote on Sep 4, 2008 12:29 AM:The train has to make it to downtown San Diego. I love that Sprinter.
Sold Out wrote on Sep 4, 2008 1:20 AM:We are being sold toll roads instead of mass public transportation, because that is what the politicians decided. No toll road will get you from SD to LA in an hour! Another example of planning by institutional politicians lacking vision.
John E wrote on Sep 4, 2008 7:07 AM:The most cost-effective part of the route is Los Angels to the Bay Area. We already have decent rail service connecting the urban cores of Los Angeles and San Diego.
ModernRock wrote on Sep 4, 2008 7:22 AM:The "train" between Escondido to Miramar is a waste of time and money.
realist wrote on Sep 4, 2008 7:24 AM:Another boondoggle to get our money. Why would we vote to build a rail line that doesn't benefit us? If there is no plan to build the high speed rail cast in stone before the vote I would encourage everyone to vote NO! The train needs to go down I-15.
Waterway wrote on Sep 4, 2008 8:10 AM:The tracks should go over the top of the now underground Colorado River Aquiduct. The easements are already there...just over what whould have been a navitigal waterway.
Billion Not wrote on Sep 4, 2008 9:22 AM:Considering it cost about a half a billion dollars to build the Sprinter on existing tracks and with an existing right-of-way, there's no way in the world a high-speed rail project is going to cost less than half a trillion dollars.
I'm a big fan of rail, love the Sprinter (not the cost though), but this one still doesn't make much sense to me. A ticket will cost just as much as a flight, the security will end up being just as much of a pain to get through (at least after the first "scare"), and it'll take longer to get there then on the plane.
And in the long run, I'm sure the environmentalists will insist the thing putts along at 5mph through every endangered habitat along the way. I mean if a windmill is dangerous to the birds, what are they going to say about a bullet train!
I just don't get it.
Esco Resident wrote on Sep 4, 2008 10:17 AM:Putting a high speed train down I-15 is a joke. Too much money has already been spent with widening the freeway to add carpool lanes. If this is going to be a high speed train use the already exisiting track of along the coast. Get rid of AMTRACK. It's a huge waste of tax payer dollars and it should have been replaced years ago.
windsor wrote on Sep 4, 2008 10:52 AM:The rail line needs to extend down the coast where the grades are flat and right-of-way exists. It also needs to go to downtown SD and the airport, not terminate to the east along I-15.
time to move wrote on Sep 4, 2008 11:21 AM:this is a crazy stae with too many people. Born and raised here but it's just becoming too much of a drag,,,
FREE RIDE wrote on Sep 4, 2008 4:12 PM:Before you vote for any rail system, check out the Cato inatitute report by Randal O'Tool on line. This will never suport itself, riders never want to pay enough to begin to cover costs. This rail systen will make the Escondido Art Center look like a bargin.Realist is correct, boondogle.
Derek wrote on Sep 4, 2008 9:44 PM:"This will never suport itself, riders never want to pay enough to begin to cover costs."
Every high speed rail system in the world makes a profit. Even the northeast corridor's Acela Express in our own country does, and it has even taken a good deal of market share from the airlines. So why would California HSR be an exception?
Dave wrote on Sep 13, 2008 3:36 PM:HSR is meant to be a replacement for air travel, not necessarily driving. The LA to SF route makes the most sense because so many flights per day happen. This is slightly faster, and significantly cheaper. Connecting San Diego is more about avoiding flights to SF and Sacramento, not just rail to LA.
Portland and Seattle are looking at something similar, designed to compete with air travel, not auto travel between midpoints. The midpoints are there so you don't need to drive to an airport to go to SF or Oakland.
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